Save Our State  

Go Back   Save Our State > General Forum (non official Save Our State business) > State Government

State Government Issues of importance to SOS associates relating to their state government.

Immigration Pushed To The Forefront Again.... Thanks! To Everyone Who Has Propelled This Issue To Its' Rightful Position. Years Of Hard Work Are Paying Off.....Keep Up The Good Work!......
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 04-26-2013, 08:30 PM
ilbegone's Avatar
ilbegone ilbegone is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,066
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LAPhil View Post
I don't agree with that at all. Voting is a privilege which is given to us. Jury service isn't a privilege or something people are entitled to, it's something they provide for us at their own expense in many cases, not to mention the inconvenience.
It is a chip away to the direction of giving illegals the right to vote, just like giving drivers licenses (with the motor voter automatic registration) to illegals would enfranchise them to vote.

AND WHO WILL THEY VOTE FOR WHEN ALLOWED TO DO SO?

They will vote for the party which caters to them, which party includes a whole delegation of those Americans who want to entirely change the character of America - and those political knuckleheads (who quite often live up on the hill and not among those they bring in) have no idea of what they are really bringing about.

We get back to the basics of what is being wrought, regardless of the "joys" to you and I of jury service:

It's ultimately about national sovereignty, allowing foreigners to sit in judgement over our citizens, our laws, our legal disputes, and further allow them to set legal precedence,

And to give foreigners the jury box is a big step towards giving foreigners who have no loyalty or sympathy for our country the ballot box.

It's about "One World", "world without borders", "citizen of the world", "Racist American imperialism" among much else that is being exploited by other agendas.

There are lots of agendas in this pie, not just Aztlanistas, not just "white privilege" race baiters, not just far left Birkenstock wearing kumbaya usefull idiot crowd cum Stalinist style communists, but many more.

I have no love for the Republican party, but the Democrat party has the largest collection of useful idiots among them all.
__________________
Freibier gab's gestern

Hay burros en el maiz

RAP IS TO MUSIC WHAT ETCH-A-SKETCH IS TO ART

Don't drink and post.

"A nickel will get you on the subway, but garlic will get you a seat." - Old New York Yiddish Saying

"You can observe a lot just by watching." Yogi Berra

Old journeyman commenting on young apprentices - "Think about it, these are their old days"

SOMETIMES IT JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

Never, ever, wear a bright colored shirt to a stand up comedy show.


Last edited by ilbegone; 04-26-2013 at 08:58 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 04-27-2013, 07:14 AM
LAPhil LAPhil is offline
Continent Thief
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Tralfamador
Posts: 454
Default

Well I guess we just fundamentally disagree. I don't see any connection between allowing foreigners to serve on a jury and getting the right to vote without becoming citizens first. And why do you assume that just because they're not citizens they have no loyalty to this country? Many of them may be in the process of becoming citizens, as the process takes time. Being a juror is simply a matter of deciding guilt or innocence in a criminal matter or liability in a civil matter, and being a non-citizen is not de facto an obstacle to that. As I said earlier, the attorneys can dismiss anyone for cause, and if they feel that a particular person is not qualified they will not hesitate to dismiss that person.
__________________
OPEN BORDERS AND MASS AMNESTY

Ich Bin Ein Arizonan!

"I entirely reject the concept, however, of "anchor babies." If parents are found to be here illegally, then the whole family, children as well, should be sent back to the parents' country of origin."
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 04-27-2013, 08:48 AM
ilbegone's Avatar
ilbegone ilbegone is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,066
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LAPhil View Post
Well I guess we just fundamentally disagree. I don't see any connection between allowing foreigners to serve on a jury and getting the right to vote without becoming citizens first. And why do you assume that just because they're not citizens they have no loyalty to this country? Many of them may be in the process of becoming citizens, as the process takes time. Being a juror is simply a matter of deciding guilt or innocence in a criminal matter or liability in a civil matter, and being a non-citizen is not de facto an obstacle to that. As I said earlier, the attorneys can dismiss anyone for cause, and if they feel that a particular person is not qualified they will not hesitate to dismiss that person.
We very much disagree and I respect your right to disagree with my view.

America is the land of a free ride (or relatively so) for many foreigners who come here. Taking the ride doesn't necessarily indicate any sort of affection for the host. The Boston bombing is clear enough proof of that, and going through the motions of getting citizenship doesn't mean anything is either learned or appreciated. Citizenship sells cheap in this country.

The tendency among Mexican nationals and middle easterners is to merely be residents in America while holding a general disdain for America and Americans. Green cards and citizenship doesn't change that mindset, although there are a couple of them I know who hate Mexico for reasons both expressed and not stated.

Maybe all that is irrelevant.

Jury duty is thankless, from waiting to be called or dismissed all friggin' day in an overheated, 98% humidity room containing three times as many people gasping for air it was designed for to the fact that it takes a chunk out of your income whether or not you are chosen. I have served on juries, and I know for a fact that the screening doesn't weed out all the naive (either way) and those with their mind made up before trial begins. I'm dismissed anymore because I speak the truth based upon my experiences.

However to give jury duty to foreigners is like giving away distasteful parts of your work when times are good - when work slows down that distasteful work never comes back because the people who filled the slot work cheaper and are willing to take a lot more shit than you are and you are no longer in the market and you no longer have an income.

And it all comes back to SOVEREIGNTY

You don't give away parts of your house to strangers, you might eventually find yourself on the street.

I've already explained the jury box to ballot box dominoes, but here it is again:

Every possible straw is being grasped to give illegals voting privilege through progressive legitimization. It's going on now with school board elections and other very local matters where it becomes both a chip in the system and a precedence - a future justification for more and bigger chips to be taken.

That's the attempt with driver's licenses for illegals regardless of all the false rhetoric about public safety, it's a step towards legitimization.

Give green card holders the jury box when the jury pool is selected from the voter registration list, the demand will be to change the law to allow green card holders to vote... and the justification offered for giving green cards the jury box is the falsehood that the jury pool isn't large enough.

With green card voting accomplished we have a nation without borders and the rationalization will be that it's discriminatory to exclude illegal alien squatters from the ballot box...

You don't have to believe me, just study Jose Angel Gutierrez and how his failed La Raza Unida party became the very model for government takeover one chip at a time and hanging on to it. It's gone on for 40 plus years, and it's working.
__________________
Freibier gab's gestern

Hay burros en el maiz

RAP IS TO MUSIC WHAT ETCH-A-SKETCH IS TO ART

Don't drink and post.

"A nickel will get you on the subway, but garlic will get you a seat." - Old New York Yiddish Saying

"You can observe a lot just by watching." Yogi Berra

Old journeyman commenting on young apprentices - "Think about it, these are their old days"

SOMETIMES IT JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

Never, ever, wear a bright colored shirt to a stand up comedy show.


Last edited by ilbegone; 04-27-2013 at 09:49 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 04-27-2013, 10:14 AM
Ayatollahgondola's Avatar
Ayatollahgondola Ayatollahgondola is offline
SOS Associate
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,047
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LAPhil View Post
Well I guess we just fundamentally disagree. I don't see any connection between allowing foreigners to serve on a jury and getting the right to vote without becoming citizens first. And why do you assume that just because they're not citizens they have no loyalty to this country? Many of them may be in the process of becoming citizens, as the process takes time. Being a juror is simply a matter of deciding guilt or innocence in a criminal matter or liability in a civil matter, and being a non-citizen is not de facto an obstacle to that. As I said earlier, the attorneys can dismiss anyone for cause, and if they feel that a particular person is not qualified they will not hesitate to dismiss that person.
Have you been to court recently Phil?
Attorney's do not get carte blanche pre-emptory challenges. There are limits, else they would juror shop til they drop.

As a citizen, the juror is presumed to know the state and federal constitutions. Native born are taught those in school. Immigrants who become citizens are schooled in both and must pass a test. Non-immigrants have no such requirements to learn it, or inherent values that are often absorbed by exposure after being raised here. This bill makes zero provision for an understanding of law or constitution. None Phil! All you need to have is a visa, and it could be a tourist visa, because that's lawful presence.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 04-27-2013, 10:29 AM
LAPhil LAPhil is offline
Continent Thief
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Tralfamador
Posts: 454
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ayatollahgondola View Post
As a citizen, the juror is presumed to know the state and federal constitutions. Native born are taught those in school. Immigrants who become citizens are schooled in both and must pass a test. Non-immigrants have no such requirements to learn it, or inherent values that are often absorbed by exposure after being raised here. This bill makes zero provision for an understanding of law or constitution.
AG, that is an excellent point and I have to admit I hadn't thought of it. Maybe this is a bad idea after all.
__________________
OPEN BORDERS AND MASS AMNESTY

Ich Bin Ein Arizonan!

"I entirely reject the concept, however, of "anchor babies." If parents are found to be here illegally, then the whole family, children as well, should be sent back to the parents' country of origin."
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 04-27-2013, 12:23 PM
Patriotic Army Mom Patriotic Army Mom is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 829
Default

I want my Country back!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:47 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright SaveOurState 2009 - 2016 All Rights Reserved