Sandy Hook & Other Mass Shootings
 

Following the Sandy Hook Shooting coverage, something hit me: THERE ARE NO WOUNDED AT SANDY HOOK. ALL VICTIMS ARE REPORTED DEAD. THE SANDY HOOK SHOOTER ACHIEVED A 100% MORTALITY RATE. By comparison, in all other mass shootings there were more wounded than dead.

It also appears that all the eye witnesses who actually saw him or any of the killings have been eliminated as well. All persons interviewed in the media only "heard gunfire" and did not actually see the shooter or the shootings.


Briefly, the overview is as follows:

Sandy Hook School (2012)
Shot: 26
Killed: 26 (100%)
Wounded -0-


Aurora Theater Shooting (2012)
Shot: 71
Killed: 12 (16.9%)
Wounded: 59 (83.1%)


Tucson AZ Shooting (2011)
Shot: 14
Killed: 6 (42.8%)
Wounded: 8 (57.1%)


Columbine School Shooting (1999)
Shot: 33
Killed: 12 (36%)
Wounded: 21 (63.6%)


Stockton School Shooting (1989)
Shot: 35
Killed: 5 (14.2%)
Wounded: 30 (85.7%)


Note that the 26 victims included 20 children and 6 adults. Even if children, because of their small size, are more vulnerable to gunshot wounds, based on the statistical history of other mass shootings at least half of the 6 adult victims should have survived. None did.

Perhaps the most similar mass shooting is the infamous Columbine School event in Colorado in 1999, where two students, armed with multiple fire arms and many bombs and acting according to a long worked out plan, shot 33 classmates but still achieved only a 36% fatality rate and produced twice as many wounded as dead.

Sandy Hook is statistically out of line with all other mass shootings, where the wounded exceeded the dead, and much of the information being published would only have been known to people who are now shown to have been killed and could not have reported it.

The .223 used in this incident is not a death ray, but is identical to the weapon used in the Aurora Theater shooting which resulted in 5 wounded for every victim killed. The .223 is a reliable killer on jackrabbits and ground squirrels but is marginal on coyotes and is not legal for hunting deer.

There is another weird aspect of Sandy Hook: NO SECURITY CAMERA VIDEO HAS BEEN PRODUCED.

The school district's web site posted it's policies on security cameras and promulgated a retention period of 5 days. The only other mass killing incident I've heard of where security camera footage was NOT produced was the Pentagon on 9/11. Joe Schmoe's Liquor Store has security cam's but not the Pentagon or the Sandy Hook School!

Well, that might be noteworthy, but then again, I thought I read that the kids in Sandy Hook were shot more than once each, which would contribute heavily to the mortality factor. Plus they are unskilled in manuevering away from the danger, and trapped in a smaller, more confined space.

I doubt we have all the information that the investigation has too. They may not even be required to divulge it in that state

St. Valentine's Day Massacre 1929.

In this famous 1929 mass shooting, the Capone gang tried to wipe out the Moran Gang and shot 7 men in a garage, all lined up against a wall and offering no resistance.

Two professional killers using Thompson .45 caliber submachine guns fired 100 rounds into the seven stationary victims, sweeping their guns back and forth Notwithstanding this hail of automatic weapons fire, one victim survived 14 gunshot wounds and was transported to a hospital where he regained consciousness and was questioned by the police only to expire later in the day.

Bottom line: It is not easy to achieve a 100 % fatality rate in mass shootings, notwithstanding multiple hits from two professional shooters using machine guns.

Separate and apart from achieving a 100% fatality rate at Sandy Hook, all of the eye witnesses appear to have been eliminated as well. How convenient.

How amazing that a reclusive, psychologically disturbed 20 year old was single handedly able to achieve a feat unmatched by two professional killers using superior weapons and assisted by accomplices on a smaller number of victims. It must have been the video games.

I'll admit the statisitcs are odd, and the absence of witnesses is unusual given the number of people in the area. I'd be hesitant to agree that the machine-gunners were professional killers. That's often a term used by prosecutors to obtain the death penalty. A real professional killer is someone who administers the lethal injection, or otherwise carried out death penalty punishment. From there, a professional gets a bit sketchy. Someone who has to use an automatic to kill 7 detained men is more of a hatchet man or men.
But once again, it is odd that there were no survivors that were wounded. actually very odd. Not entirely incomprehensible though. I gotta wonder if there's something the press isn't being told yet, such as the rounds containing poison.

Update to my original post regarding the apparent killing of all eye witnesses and the absence of any wounded victims:

Two percipient witnesses, including one who sustained gunshot wounds, who saw the shooter have appeared.

(1) A Sandy Hook School staffer named Natalie Hammond was with the Principal and School Psychologist when the three of them were confronted by the shooter who opened up killing the other two and wounding Natalie Hammond in the hand, leg and foot. She crawled into an adjacent room and survived.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...r-played-dead/

(2) The second percipient, but uninjured, witness was an as yet unnamed 6 year old girl who "played dead" while here class mates were shot to death. Presumably she had her eyes closed while "playing dead", but she would most certainly have seen the shooter burst into the room.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...r-played-dead/

This still amounts to a fatality rate of approximately 92%...higher than any other known mass shooting. Thus far the two reported surviving eye witnesses have confirmed reports of a single shooter.

Prelude;
 

Yes I did hear that there were wounded survivors. But the media, typically in the rush to out do and report, also produced other erroneous information. Often they are running on speculation, fragments and sometimes just plain false stuff.

But backing up:

I received an E-mail from a friend to the effect that there was a report that the shooters Mother was actually a CIA operative. She did own an AR15 as well as at least two Glock 9's. The Glock's have a horrendous capability to spew out jaw dropping volumes of rounds. There are astonishing videos on U Tube. It isn't unusual for women to own guns and both hunt and shoot at the range but to own an AR15 as well as two Glock 9''s ???? Normally the ladies seem to prefer a Smith and Wesson PINK six shooter revolver. It seems the Mother was an enthusiastic practitioner at the gun ranges. It isn't difficult to figure out where the shooter acquired his shooting skills as well as his weapons.

I own lots of guns. I keep then in a locked gun locker. Same for my son. How did the shooter acquire his Mom's guns ?

I hear that the shootings occurred primarily in TWO class rooms. It would be like shooting fish in a barrel. The ultra high volumes of fire and multiple wounds could account for the high mortality as opposed to possible other circumstances in the other shootings.

As to the AR15 coming in .223 caliber and being "marginal for coyotes, the latest issue of the NRA American Hunter Magazine contains an article by an avid coyote hunter who evaluated 9 calibers for the firearm. The AR15 actually has been manufactured to shoot many calibers ranging from .17 to .25. The .17 is particularly lethal because it has a projectile of 4,00o fps in 30 grain bullets. All of the calibers are good coyote rounds. Some better than others.

The article goes on to say that the .17 caliber leaves a very small entrance wound channel and that it usually does not come out the other side. That means the energy dump is all inside. For fur gatherers that is attractive because it doesn't cause much pelt damage. There is the matter of 'hydraulic shock" too. U Tube videos of shooting a water melon vividly demonstrate the explosive results. So the internal damage to a live target would essentially turn the insides into mush. The article says coyotes drop like a rock in their tracks with some calibers. However, some other calibers like the .222 have resulted in the coyotes limping off and being lost. So the criteria is first caliber and the grains of bullet weight and velocity. Further, according to the author, fast follow up shots are also a plus. So shooting the kids would be like spraying them with a garden hose.

Wayne La Pierre advocated armed guards in every school. I agree entirely just like I promoted the arming of airline pilots and sky marshal's. Sadly the liberals and gun opponents remain deaf dumb and stupid about protecting the schools. Those schools are sitting ducks and the would be shooters know it. Some deterrent will give pause for thought. There are lots of other ways to improve security, locked doors, bars on windows, controlled access. Look at what it takes now to board an airplane. But why rail, rant and rave. The gun controllers are too stupid to comprehend.

* What about the Nickel Mines Amish school shooting in Pennsylvania. The shooter killed 5 in a one room school and wounded 4. He used a Springfield XD 9mm subcompact hand gun. Not much of a weapon for mass killing.

NO guns in schools? Until very recently high school ROTC units all had guns in schools. I was captain of my ROTC rifle team. We had .22 Rem Target Rifles and M-1's and M-1 Carbines in the armory and every cadet was trained in handling, stripping and maintaining the M-1.

I have never done a study of crimes by ROTC personnel, but I have never heard of any. When I was in high school the problem was violence associated with football games with other schools and the ROTC people were never involved in that.

As for "assault weapons" if our presidents are claiming the right to have us killed as "terrorists" without charges, trials, or any other notice or due process, I want to be equally as well armed as the people that the President may send to kill me if he decides to designate me that way.



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I remember hearing about this Amish school shooting. According to your info, he shot 9, killed 5 and wounded 4. More than 50% mortality but far short of the 93% of Sandy Hook.

The CIA angle always comes up. Who knows? I have always suspected that many of these mass shootings were false flag ops designed to influence public opinion against gun ownership, especially Sandy Hook with such a high mortality rate and the apparent elimination of all eye wit's. Now we have two eye wit's and it turns out one person was wounded. As a shooter, it bugs me that 26 people were killed but that the one wounded survivor, shot at point blank range, was shot in the hand, the foot and the leg. Clearly peripheral wounds. How do you miss at the close range he was shooting?

Much of the real truth will never be known because this is being used for political purposes.

The one survivor shot in the hand, foot, leg, may have been on the move....evading. The kids were anchored to their classrooms like sitting ducks. I'll bet that many of those kids have similarly placed entry wounds, but that their small bodies just bled out faster. this shooter was just plain evil in this act. How he got that way is still a matter for investigation, but whatever did possess him to carry this out was surely evil in origin.

I grew up with a kid that was quite different from most of the rest of us. He was a rebellious, larcenous, bold delinquent. Always at the root of others in his follow in destroying property. Schools too. Also destroyed a local tv station to the tune of 200K. He challenged one of his sidewalk commando henchkids to shoot a cigarette from his hand. Did I say challenged? Damn near forced him by goad and threat. He ended up with a 22 projectile going through his hand, leaving him in a cast for several months whith his finger like it was flipping the bird at everyone. He wore it as a medal through school.
12 years after high school he fired a shotgun at several people in the park, seeing them as some sort of demons that were a threat to him. He was tried and sentenced to 10 years in the state prison hospital, and has been denied release every year since, as late as this one. 25 years as a person too much a threat to release. This kid was a product of the 50's and 60's like me

Debatable:
 

Naturally there are pros and cons, proponents and opponents to gun control.

I have seen arguments here that are so specious and absent of any logic that they are laughable. But to each his own.

Putting armed guards in schools is no different than putting police on the streets. The British put Bobbie's on the street unarmed which is just absurd.

Among my guns there is NOT any auto or semi automatic rifle. I'm an old fashioned hunter that uses only classic and conventional long guns. That included muzzle loaders. However, I fully support my fellow arms owners who want to own the rapid fire, clip, semi autos. We cannot give an inch to gun control. Not even a fraction. England Australia and Canada gave in and rolled over much to the catastrophic astonishment of decent, law abiding gun owners.

Apart from my having total disdain for Democrats and liberals, I am now also thoroughly disgusted with many in Congress - House and Senate. Forget about the Looney tune Mayors !!!!!

As La Pierre points out guns are tools. They are inanimate. They don't do anything until someone makes them do it. So the gun controllers have mis-identified the culprit. It is the nutty lunatics not the GUNS !!!!!

Take away guns and they will use knifes. Take away knifes and they will use grenades. Take away grenades and they will use bombs. Take away bombs and they will use clubs. Timothy McVeigh used ANFO in Oklahoma. Fertilizer and diesel fuel. He did a much better job. Got lots more people. Take away guns and we will have them loading cars with explosives and suicide bombing like Iraq and Afghanistan. I'm surprised that there hasn't been more of that.

The anti gun controllers are dim wits. Give them an inch and they will take a mile. This present hue and cry is predominantly an excuse to further their agenda.

I totally agree that it is highly desirable for home owners to be heavily armed with automatic weapons particularly in view of the worst, most dangerous and untrustworthy Government in the Nations history. All the more in view of the super abundance of Communists and racists occupying s many positions. When Fidel Castro and Hugo Chavez put their stamp of approval on it you had better wake up and smell the coffee.

BTY it is the law in Switzerland that every able bodied man MUST have arms in his home.

Here in the USA I would advocate that all legitimate state Militias must be armed with automatic/semi automatic rifles.

It has been noted that the perpetrator of the shootings at Sandy Hook elementary was well above average intelligence, and quite mechanically adept. He could have easily devised several bombs and orchestrated their detonation to achieve an even far worse amount of killing and mayhem. He may have chosen to use his mother's guns for a much different reason: To get back at her using the tools she cherished for her own freedom and safety. Who knows? All that time she was teaching him to use them, he may have been in full resentment

Don't judge the mother.

Not all these symptoms may be present concerning those with Asbergers syndrome, but there is a common thread and variation of severity. Some may find a niche and become producers in their own way and many are quite intelligent - there is a notion that Einstein exhibited symptoms of Asbergers, as well as others who have contributed greatly to science and other aspects of society.

Some can learn social clues and become liked, but will always be "different". Some will never experience sex, others will experience monogamy or promiscuity. There can quite a bit of anger stuffed inside in some due to societal or familial rejection. They can be very loving to those they are close to, others will boil and churn concerning childhood or continuing experiences.

The larger question is not about guns or mental illness or mental conditions, as we have always had those among us. What has happened to our society which has given permission to both sane and mentally ill people to mass murder complete strangers? How do we socially revoke this condition?

here was another elementary school shooting in 1988 in the State of Illinois where a lone gunman, or gunwoman, Laurie Wesserman, entered Hubbard Woods Elementary School with a .357 magnum, 32 S& W and .22 LR Baretta and shot five children. One died and 4 survived.

That's a death rate of 20% and a survival rate of 80%, the exact opposite of Sandy Hook. This involved shooting children inside a building.

It should also be noted that the Illinois children in class rooms are reported to have scattered and tried to run away rather than meekly submit to being shot and killed as reported about Sandy Hook.

My basis position is that the death rate at Sandy Hook is statistically out of the norm with all other mass shootings, even mass shootings of school children who's movements were confined by being inside class rooms, as in Hubbard Woods elementary school where 80% of the victims survived.

The historically and statistically unprecedented death rate at Sandy Hook strongly suggests more than one shooter was involved. This is a morbid subject to have to research and deal with, but it has extraordinary political consequences and we cannot allow ourselves to be blinded and our ability to ask questions to be cut off because of emotion and sentimentality.

The young man spent a lot of time at the range. Anyone can blaze away semi auto and hit nothing.

There are people who actually can shoot through a coin tossed in the air and hit several clay targets released at the same time which are traveling different directions, no misses.

It seems there is yet another conspiracy theory begging to be hit on, and this is the one.

Chemtrails, anyone?

Our government hasn't told the truth about anything since the Spanish American War and the calcified, inflexible thinking reflected in your post does little to challenge the ability of the ruling class to control the narrative and herd people, like sheep, in to supporting their own enslavement and dispossession as well as pointless wars.

Responding to the Bengazi incident members of the US government, including the President, fabricated a completely false story about a Youtube video being the precipitating factor. We quickly learned that was a lie. It was also the product of a conspiracy. The 9/11 attack was the product of a conspiracy, as was the Columbine school shooting.

The mainstream media in the US is a branch of the Democratic party and it lies incessantly to further the agenda of the left, whether it's the dispossession of Americans by 3d world primitives or the restriction of constitutional rights.

Yes, there is a conspiracy Don. But you dilute and belittle the attempt to expose it by over-reaching into un-proven, far-fetched theories that detract from the real truths, and divert the attention of those who might otherwise take an interest in it. Wolf-crying is not helping. Not that there may not be wolves, but calling for help when you have only theorized their existence is going to get you, and possibly any real sightings, dismissed as crackpot.

By the way; Is my wife considered one of the "third-world primatives", being a Chommorro from the island of Guam? Just curious, since there is no real definition. :confused:

Of course our government lies to us, much more since Obama became president.

And, yes, so called "journalism" is now a grab bag of politically slanted opinion, propaganda and sensationalism. They lie too, both for the far right and the far left although mostly for the left.

Benghazi was on foreign soil with a presidential election in the balance. Obama and his lackeys won by stalling, lying, denying and changing the subject with most of the press refusing to address it.

Sandy Hook was on US soil within a mainstream community. Were each and every one of the witnesses to the slaughter of children as well as all the media coached, choreographed and coerced into fabricated stories by the CIA, FBI, Secret Service, NSA, ATF, and the local police in order to further some Obama agenda? Such a premise is bullshit, plain and simple.

The wars had a point indeed, but the point got lost with the wars being run as though it were by a corporation competing on the cheap with King George as CEO rather than war understood to be a nasty undertaking to be quickly won by generals let off the leash.

911 was a foreign conspiracy hatched and carried out by religious lunatics.

Columbine was a conspiracy between student misfits given permission to do their deed by changes in American society.

The dispossession of Americans is not so much by third worlders as it is by elected denizens of Washington DC and American businesses down the street from your residence. They and they alone make it possible for your house to be inundated with Nortena music 24/7 from all four sides. (Nortena, Cumbia, grupero and Ranchera music often plays within my house. Does that make myself and Elena - who were both born here - third world primitives? Or does blues, classic rock, funk, 60's black music and Big Band also played take away the "taint"?)

You have to give credit where credit is due. Benghazigate had a political motive for the clumsy cover up, there is no political expediency for the government to murder American children with multiple gunmen and use an Asberger's syndrome sufferer and his mother as patsies. That notion is just as irrational as the deed itself.

A month after the shooting and we still haven't seen any photo's of the actual rifle used. All photos of the "AR15" in the media are generic photos of AR15 type rifles...with different barrel lengths, different sights, different stocks, etc.

At his press conference, the medical examiner said he couldn't determine the caliber of the bullets used, but that all victims were killed by the "long rifle." If he can't determine the caliber of the bullets used, how can he determine the rifle that killed them? He's not an eye witness and didn't see the shootings.

WHERE ARE THE PICS OF THE ACTUAL RIFLE USED. If we can see pic's of the "dead children" we should be allowed to see pics of the "Assuault rifle" supposedly used to shoot them.

Don't know anything about connecticut law, but here the courts must make evidence public. Unfortunately though, where there is no trial, it is an investigation, and the evidence release is up to the DA and the law enforcement agency that has jurisdiction. Quite obviously those two agencies are witholding those to get undeserved propaganda from the release of the weapon. Don't know what else to make of it